Is Hugo Chavez a Threat to Stability?

Submitted by fyl on 5 April, 2007 - 08:11.

Znet offers an analysis of whether Chavez is a threat to regional stability. The conclusion, which you would expect, is no but the article offers some good analysis and a comparison of what Venezuela is doing vs. what the IMF was doing.

For example, before the Nicaraguan elections last November, US government officials made many threats to the voters of that country that if they elected Daniel Ortega, they would suffer greatly from cutoffs of loans, aid, and even the remittances that many Nicaraguans depend upon from their relatives in the United States. None of these threats have been carried out. This is partly because Washington knows it would be useless and counterproductive to do so, since Nicaragua would simply replace US-controlled funding sources with more borrowing from Venezuela.

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Enough Already

Submitted by fyl on 9 July, 2007 - 10:03.

This forum is now very off track. I have closed it to further comments.

Minority church membership

Submitted by expatyank on 7 July, 2007 - 07:53.

For all members of minority religons. You must force your women to have more babys. You must shorten the breeding cycle in order to outproduce the normal cycle. Stop breast feeding as soon as possible since this will bring her back into a fertile state quicker. Yes it is true that on a world wide basis a few kids will starve. Many more will be as dumb as a box of rocks from poor nutrition. But look how well this theory has worked so far. Think of the power the majority religions have over your lives right now. Also since some of the minority religions have given women a voice in some affairs this needs to be changed. After all by keeping them where they belong the majority religions have managed to maintain a great deal of political influence on a world wide basis. There are some countrys that even deny women of minority religions control over their own bodys.

I do not understand the

Submitted by wmac on 7 July, 2007 - 08:46.

I do not understand the relation of this message to Chavez!?

i suspect....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 7 July, 2007 - 08:31.

you have just described the wahabbi plan for world domination! but in that religion, women don't have much in the way of rights.

Chavez and sadam

Submitted by wmac on 3 July, 2007 - 06:55.

Ok, Look at this article and see the pictures on Iranian website

http://www.baztab.com/news/70613.php

I translate the article for you:

----

The same time as Chavez is visiting Iran and It has been announced that "Iran is Chavez' Second Home!!!", some Iranian websites are showing the pictures of his visits to Iraq and Sadam 7 years ago.

Chavez was the last president which visited Sadam and Iraq before US attack to Iraq. At that time UN had confirmed that Iraq's had been responsible for the 8 years war with Iran. Chavez had invited Sadam to visit Venezuela at that time.

Yesterday Chavez visited the Iranian Martyrs of the War with Iraq and Paid tribute to them!!!"

-----

I should add that after Iraq attacked Iran in 1980 an 8 year war started which resulted into death of 1.5 million people from both sides and perhaps 3 million Injuries.

A few days ago the same website showed the written order of Sadam to his Air force to use chemical weapons against Iran during the war. Chemical weapons (supplied by US and European countries) killed and effected almost 200,000 Iranian soldiers and civil people some of which are alive yet and live in hospitals etc. under daily care.

You judge what kind of human is Chavez and what kind of relation with Iran could he want.

In IBD yesterday. The "Axis of Unity"

Submitted by thorvin55 on 4 July, 2007 - 11:17.

War On Terror: We have a new "axis" to worry about -- the "Axis of Unity" just formed by Iran and Venezuela. Time to pay attention: Iran is openly fighting us in the Mideast. Now it's getting ready to fight us here, too.

We've talked a great deal about Iran's threat. Simply put, we think Iran is at war with us, and has been since its revolution in 1979. We just haven't noticed.

Recent events only bolster our conviction. Most alarmingly, Iran's mullahs have become so emboldened by our inaction they're going from making mere threats to actively killing our soldiers in Iraq. So far, we've done little about it.

According to U.S. Brig. Gen. Kevin Bergner, Iran has begun using Hezbollah in Lebanon as a surrogate to help Shiite terrorists in Iraq kill U.S. troops.

The U.S. military, Bergner says, now has hard evidence Iran was behind an attack in Karbala last January that killed five Americans. This, by the way, is an overt act of war by a hostile government.

Iran's Islamic Revolutionary Guard also has opened three training camps near Tehran where groups of upwards of 60 Iraqis are trained in the finer arts of terrorism -- kidnapping, bomb making, torture, murder.

Truth is, Iran has become a major geopolitical malignancy. Its nuclear program is accelerating, according to Iran's envoy to the International Atomic Energy Agency. Iran still remains the world's leading supporter of terrorism.

Yet after Tehran rejected out of hand the EU's recent laughable proposal for a kindergarten-style "time out" on Iran's nuclear program, the U.N. Security Council basically just threw up its hands. For now, it says, it will do nothing about Iran's noncompliance with international nuclear agreements. It's off the agenda entirely.

Unchallenged, Iran now wants not only to establish nuclear dominance over the Mideast, but to challenge the U.S. directly.

Sound unbelievable? Over the weekend, Venezuela's dictator Hugo Chavez traveled to Tehran to sign a wide-ranging trade, investment and arms deal.

Iran-supported Hezbollah guerrillas already have set up shop in South America's jungles to train terrorists and to build a base of operations from which to attack the U.S.

In January, Iran's radical leader Mahmoud Ahmadinejad toured Latin America seeking support from the region's anti-American regimes.

He found it. Just this month, he entertained Nicaragua's Sandinista leader Daniel Ortega -- a sure sign of mischief. Now he is making deals with Chavez.

This has been going on for some time. As far back as 2002, the U.S. State Department warned Congress that al-Qaida and Hezbollah were both active in Latin America, aiding extremists and sowing terror. We've done nothing.

As we've said, these ties give Iran direct access to our hemisphere -- access it can use to disrupt U.S. energy trade or, worse, infiltrate terrorists into the U.S. through our pathetically porous borders.

That's just what Iran will do if we don't stop it either through tougher economic sanctions, covert action, military strikes on its sensitive infrastructure or some combination of the three. We no longer can wait.

you are exactly right....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 11:28.

and saddam in iraq would have been a counterbalance to iran. while saddam was a madman, he could not have lived next door to iran with nukes. now we should do it ourselves.

Yawn

Submitted by fyl on 4 July, 2007 - 11:58.

Has it occurred to anyone that each of these "problems" have been created by the US artificially creating something to counteract an existing "problem". Take the US creation of Osama bin Laden, for example--a US CIA creation to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan.

If I might bring this discussion back in the general direction of Nicaragua, what if Reagan had not decided to attack the new Sandinista government here who overthrew a long-term, US-created dictatorship?

It is well documented that there were three factions in the FSLN. While there was a lot of disagreement, they worked together toward the final victory. The directorate included Sergio Ramirez and Violetta Chammorro as well as Daniel Ortega. Clearly, those three had a very different vision of what Nicaragua needed.

I suggest that if the US had done nothing--that is, no protracted war, no CIA interference, no embargo, that you would have quickly seen the Sandinista movement split into three factions or, in other words, political parties. The US use of force against the new government, worked just like the installation of the Shah of Iran--it forced the opposition to unify to fight against an external force.

So, instead of threatening Nicaragua again--this time for who it keeps as its friends--what if the US jumped in to help in a serious way? I don't mean Nicaraguan workers in the US mailing home some money or some non-profits making donations. Build some roads (like the US did 50 years ago, Japan did a few years ago and Venezuela says they will do now). Offer to help address the electricity production/distribution mess. Train Nicaraguans to do something other than become dictators, military men and police. ...

I don't want to say the US has done nothing. On paper you see US military building a school. On the ground you see a $10,000 school being built at a cost of $10,000,000 to US taxpayers (made up numbers but probably not out of line). But, there are lots of ways the US could become a more useful "friend" than either Iran or Venezuela. Try it, it might actually work.

wow

Submitted by cbluangel on 5 July, 2007 - 05:31.

ok, this is a little confusing for me. what is real and what is propaganda? i know the u.s. is very good at it, i see enough afn spots every day to know it. but what i really need to know is will my family be safe there. we are not looking for or expecting a perfectly false safe and cozy spot, this is what we are trying to leave behind. but i also don't want to live in fear just because i'm from the states.

life is a risk....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 5 July, 2007 - 14:14.

and no one gets out alive! nicaragua has one of the safest records of central america. but i take precautions everwhere!

do a search on "peter christopher" and/or "abundance farm" on this site. fyl says mistakes were made and i believe it. there is no utopia in this world, even though all on this site would like there to be one.

Life is a risk but......

Submitted by frettless on 5 July, 2007 - 17:29.

You can minimize your risk. We have plenty of crime, some of it pretty violent where I live in the Sarasota/Bradenton area of FL but I don't live in those areas and avoid them at night. It doesn't matter where you live, you need to lock your car door and not leave anything of value in view anywhere.

if I were to

Submitted by GranadaSherif on 4 July, 2007 - 21:44.

build the school they built near la Consepcion in Carazo it would have cost me about 15 to 20K at the most as it is a 1 building school with a gravel yard and some toilets in the back.. Not very big. They did fix part of the road to Chacocente by bulldozing it over and grinding some shale rock they mined from the area into the ground, all in all it is a great improvement on what it was, but not sure how log it will last after the photo opportunities. Not sure how much it actually cost them on paper though...

agreed on helping Nicaragua

Submitted by frettless on 4 July, 2007 - 14:56.

Meaningful aid would be the way to go. I think Ho, in Vietnam went looking for US aid as well and turned to the communist Chinese when he got turned down. The rest is as they say history. Bullying is not only wrong but a waste of time. The trash talk has to end on both sides though. Until that happens not a lot of progress is going to be made.

you're right about Ho . . .

Submitted by arlington on 4 July, 2007 - 21:59.

you're right about Ho . . . but it wasn't aid he was looking for, it was a post colonial future. The League of Nations talked big about ending colonialism and imperialism at the end of WW1 - 1918 at Versailles, except they had no intention of doing anything of the sort. When Wilson rebuffed him he found support elsewhere - 1920 joins the French Communist Party. Another of the great missed opportunities of world history. If only our leaders meant half the shit they say, each successive generation wouldn't have to throw so many corpses to the field.

from the horse's mouth

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 12:37.

the only way to be a friend to an islamofacsist is to be converted or conquered. those are the friends they are interested in: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article...

western policy doesn't creat terror, terrorists do.

terrorists want "a revolutionary worldwide Islamic state"

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 12:43.

from the above article, "And though many British extremists are angered by the deaths of fellow Muslim across the world, what drove me and many others to plot acts of extreme terror within Britain and abroad was a sense that we were fighting for the creation of a revolutionary worldwide Islamic state that would dispense Islamic justice."

checkmate.

convert

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 12:44.

or conquer. a matter of will.

as dr evil would say...

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 12:46.

world domination.

I think you're talking to yourself Jim ; )

Submitted by arlington on 4 July, 2007 - 14:10.

I think you're talking to yourself Jim ; ) go have a tea. ; )

genius, i tell you....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 14:31.

Dr. Evil: "Here's the plan. We get the warhead, and we hold the world ransom for.....One MILLION DOLLARS!!" No.2: "Ahem...Don't you think we should maybe ask for *more* than a million dollars? A million dollars isn't exactly a lot of money these days. Virtucon alone makes over nine billion dollars a year!" Dr. Evil: "Really?" No.2: "Mm-hmm." Dr. Evil: "Okay then. We hold the world ransom for.....One hundred..BILLION DOLLARS!!"

Jimi, I think you do not

Submitted by wmac on 4 July, 2007 - 18:35.

Jimi, I think you do not know anything from middle east, what happens there, ... and just review the propaganda of western media without even digesting it.

Islamic movements started because US and Israel came to their lands, occupied it and attacked it. in Iraq alone US and allies killed more than 500,000 humans. In Iran CIA run a coup against national government of Dr. Mosadegh and replaced him again with the Dictator (mohammad reza shah pahlavi, and it took 40 years for the people to throw him away again in 1979), In Palestine they moved Israeli's to exactly middle of the Arabic countries and always supported killings of Palestinians and always vetoed everything against them in UN,.... You want me to continue?

Then what do you think they should do? They should either sit and look at the US taking all their lands because of the Oil and the strategic position of the middle east, or start defending themselves.

Do you want me to show US defense minister's pictures with Sadam during Iran-Iraq war? US helped Sadam to fight Iran and then attacked Sadam himself. What is the meaning of this mess?

And you speak of hardliner Islam? Yes you forced (I mean US) the Islam to become defensive to defend itself.

You want to put yourself in place of a middle eastern non-hardliner Muslim for 3 minutes? If you were Iraqi or Irani or Afghan or Palestinian... what would you do?????

Sorry, I think the jews were

Submitted by thunderdial on 4 July, 2007 - 22:34.

Sorry, I think the jews were there long before WWII. I think it's the muslims who crashed the party some time ago.

The fact is

Submitted by GranadaSherif on 5 July, 2007 - 20:22.

the jews and Muslims were living together there for at least 1500 years before the state of Israel was created.

before 1948 it was called Palestine.

the issue of Palestineans muslims, christians, and to a lesser extent arab jews (yes there are Palestinean Jews or Arabe jews that live there and have family history of over 1000 years! They consider themselves Arabs who are jewish) is freedom, discrtimination and oppression and for the lack of better words the Tyranny that the state of isreal demonstrated and continues to demonstrate. it has nothing to do with jews. Things got little distorted when Israel opened immigration doors to Jews from all over the world while confiscating Palestinian lands and preventing Palestinians Refugees from returning home then it became about jews versus Arabs and somehow later on in the last few years it became jews vs. Muslims.... thanks to the a very active media machine.

Anyways while this seem significant nowadays, it's only been about 60 years in the making. I wonder how it will be looked at 1000 years from now.

It is only young countries that makes 60 years sounds so important. 60 years in the life of Israel is 100% of its existence. 60 years to the US 19.9% of its existence (since 1776), But for the region 60 years is about 0.01% of its history.

Anyways i am sure no red blooded USA citizen would stand for what Israel does if they faced the same conditions as the Palestinian people, as evident from your history.

Nicaraguans revolted against Somoza who did probably 1/10th of what Israel does on a regular basis to Palestinians, which leads me to believe that they would not stand for is happening there either.

I would think that nobody with a sense of justice would, unless they were fed with lies and well manipulated, or guilt ridden.

The fact is Palestinians

Submitted by thunderdial on 5 July, 2007 - 23:11.

The fact is Palestinians strap bombs on their kids and send them to bus stops because of real estate. I do believe the argument is over ;)

So out

Submitted by GranadaSherif on 7 July, 2007 - 20:33.

of the entire last 2 threads this is the best statement you could come up with? I guess the argument is really over ;)

Well, yes. We could delve

Submitted by thunderdial on 8 July, 2007 - 20:35.

Well, yes. We could delve into a scholarly, philosophical discourse into all the bad bullcrap that both sides have caused each other over the milleniums and try to figure out who is wrong or right, but you know, I'd rather make an anti-abortion quilt and drape it over the national mall, or stick a red-hot fork in my eye. When you strap a bomb on your kid and send him to a bus stop, I really don't care how good of a case you had before hand. palestinians, hamas, the brotherhood, the fatah, hezbollah, pasdaran, wahabis - one day I'm gonna find a blender big enough to put all their asses in, and I am going to press puree and walk away.

And I really don't care if you're a moderate. How can you worship a prophet who signed the covenenant of Medina that endorsed pluralistic societies, and then attacked caravans with food and aid, killing the people and try to starve another city? That's not a instrument of God, it's not a prophet - it's a thug, plain and simple.

And Al Sadr, don't get me started. I'd follow his ass to where he hides, a mosque, not really care if it's a mosque, and I'd vaporize it.

sleep tight

Submitted by Jinoturistica on 8 July, 2007 - 23:18.

... one morning, someone will find your dead body with the above blog entry pinned on your cold chest.

Hate begets hate. And you have 'way more than your fair share.

Now, say something nice. Try it. Just once in your cold cold life, try it. You might like it.

Tony X Robins, Jinotega

i believe in turning the other cheek...

Submitted by Che Guevara on 9 July, 2007 - 08:44.

but when i put those green bdu's on, i still love my enemy. i don't love the cancer that infects them. i haven't heard any other way to stop the cancer other than cutting it out.

they want to convert or conquer. killing in the name of god. how can that be anything other than cancer?

i'd rather be dead than enslaved. life, no one gets out alive.

- I am sure no other country

Submitted by wmac on 9 July, 2007 - 09:47.

- I am sure no other country has killed more than US. - No other country has used Nuke against humans. - No other country has started more than 50 wars. - No other country has changed so many other governments - No one has terrorized and killed more than US agents - No one has done things you did in Iraq, In Iraqi prisons, In Vietnam, in Afghanistan, in Japan, in Korea, in Latin America. Look at your bloody hands. You eat and drink blood of innocent people. - No one and no country is as arrogant as US - No one has threatened other countries to nuke more than US ... I can count hundreds if you want.

By the way before Muslims Russian communists were devil, then others, then Muslims, ... You always have a devil. Look at yourself , perhaps you are devil.

And something else, every empire goes down a day. Persian empire of ours stayed 2500 years. Soviets stayed 100 or less. I bet yours will not take too much. Chinese are next.

No one is more evil than US imperialist government. Murderer, blood sucker, ... whatever you tell.

No one like US government creates 9/11 (kill his own people) to make excuse for capturing other countries. You think what? We believe CIA has not been aware of 9/11? Even a retarded person does not believe this. Even if Alqaeda has done it, it has been under supervision of CIA. You created Alqaeda against soviets, you eat the results.

I think you like Bin-Ladan to speak with you instead of moderates. You prefer it?

why am i evil?

Submitted by Che Guevara on 9 July, 2007 - 10:00.

because i am not muslim? i have muslim friends here, do they secretly think i am evil? because i have an army uniform? because i love my enemy and pray that god softens his heart? please help me, why am i evil?

tony, do you agree with wmac's position? can you pray on it?

thunderdial or whatever else

Submitted by wmac on 8 July, 2007 - 22:01.

thunderdial or whatever else you are, I won't bother to answer you with such an attitude. Because you are such an ...

look at the

Submitted by Che Guevara on 7 July, 2007 - 21:17.

daily mail article below. a terrorist states what they want, a world islamic state. is he a wahabbi?

I do not even know

Submitted by GranadaSherif on 7 July, 2007 - 21:51.

what a Wahabbi is!

The fact that you know more than me, suggests that you are paying too much attention to this. Which is probably not an accident.

No one in the middle east really wants an Islamic world government and no one wants to convert you. What you hear about are the words of a few extremists blown out of proportion by media to serve a particular purpose.

Wahabis are a very radical

Submitted by thunderdial on 8 July, 2007 - 20:38.

Wahabis are a very radical (radical being a relative term in islam) sect of islam started in Saudi Arabia, where they are currently being weeded out by the kingdom. They have subsequently set up shop int he tribal areas of Pakistan.

there are 1 billion muslims....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 7 July, 2007 - 22:03.

the world over. if 1% wants the great satan dead, that's 10 million. that could cause a lot of damage.

this hardliner says it has nothing to do with israel....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 21:35.

please read the story, bc unless you were a terrorist, i think he has more credibility: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article...

the usa was not even in existence for the "The First Crusade was launched in 1095 by Pope Urban II with the dual goals of liberating the sacred city of Jerusalem and the Holy Land from Muslims and freeing the Eastern Christians from Muslim rule. What started as an appeal to the French knightly class quickly turned into a wholesale migration and conquest of territory outside of Europe."

did you read what the terrorist wants? he says it! terrorists want "a revolutionary worldwide Islamic state"

from the above article, "And though many British extremists are angered by the deaths of fellow Muslim across the world, what drove me and many others to plot acts of extreme terror within Britain and abroad was a sense that we were fighting for the creation of a revolutionary worldwide Islamic state that would dispense Islamic justice."

so tell me, why are you more credible than a terrorist? or are you saying the whole story is propaganda? but mamoud ahmadenijad says he wants the return of the 12th imam. is that propaganda too?

Ahmadi-Nezhad wants the

Submitted by wmac on 4 July, 2007 - 22:23.

Ahmadi-Nezhad wants the return of 12th Imam? Every Shia-Muslim wants it, so what? return of the 12th Imam is one of Shia-Muslim's belief since 14 century ago. The same as some Christians which think Jesus Christ will return someday.

And Ahmadi-Nezhad can want whatever the hell he wants! (the same as Bush which may want the entire world and the oil). Iranian not necessarily want what he wants. Actually according a recent Poll around 90% of the people hate him or just do not want him.

The difference between Ahmadi-Nezhad and bush is that Ahmadi-Nezhad is a Mad man which speaks too much and does nothing (he is not able to do anything actually) but Bush has the power to ruin the world (and he has committed that).

Ahmadi-Nezhad WANTED to help poor people, spent almost 100 billion USD of oil money in just 2 years and the result was 100% inflation in just two years (the highest ever record in the history of the country). You see he is not able to do SHIT. People in Iran call him "Ahmaghi-nezhad" (Ahmagh=Stupid, nezhad=race , meaning : from a stupid race). ((If you are interested I will forward you some of the critics/comics/rants against him which is being circulated by email daily and I receive a copy))

He has spoken of removal of Israeli regime but never can do that but US has done that with several countries. Which is worse?

Israel has more than 300 nukes and even US can not attack it. Then you tell me threatening a Nation which has 300 nukes (impossible mission) is worse or actual ruining of a nation.

12th imam =

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 22:26.

armageddon. good luck with whatever you are selling, bc you didn't respond to the terrorist saying he wants a world islamic state.

- Armageddon?? What is this?

Submitted by wmac on 4 July, 2007 - 22:40.

- Armageddon?? What is this? I have answered this once a few weeks ago. I do not know who has attached this title to "Imam Mahdi".

First of all tell me what do you know about 12th Imam? (and your source of information please).

- Terrorists are human beings. There is a very simple Psychological reason for their actions. (most of the time)

Something bad happens to them, their country or their relatives and they want to take revenge.

- I do not justify their actions in anyway and I have always hated them. In the first hours of 9/11 I visited several US websites and told my condolences (as did president Khatami).

Terrorists are not human

Submitted by thunderdial on 4 July, 2007 - 22:57.

Terrorists are not human beings. And as long as Iran dispatches the Pasdaran into various places in the mideast for the purpose of assisting and training terrorist, then I'll clump it into the same category as the terrorist. Iran will learn their lesson soon enough.

your arguments remind me of a policeman and crowd control

Submitted by Che Guevara on 4 July, 2007 - 23:03.

"move along, nothing to see here."

you are trying too hard.

"Hey, is that hard? Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh I said HARD!" (line from beavis)

yes, I know. I had been

Submitted by wmac on 5 July, 2007 - 00:32.

yes, I know. I had been warned of this before I start

glad we agree

Submitted by Che Guevara on 5 July, 2007 - 13:45.

on something! what do you make of this: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/07/05/nterror4...

btw, this can't be usa propaganda, it comes from the uk!

Jimi I gave up with you.

Submitted by wmac on 5 July, 2007 - 18:16.

Jimi I gave up with you. Once again, I am not here to justify terrorist acts.

If US and UK were not in the middle east these kinds of things would not happen. Each new war and conflict in middle east will bring more of these to your lands. People in these countries will try to make your country unsafe, the same as you have done to their countries.

It's only a stupid method of revenge and defense. They could instead focus on development of their countries. As Dr. Muhatir Mohammad of Malaysia once told (if I remember correctly) the economic capabilities of a country are the most powerful defense (while I think military defense capabilities should come along with it).

You put people of middle east in defensive position and ask yourself "why the hell they are trying to defend themselves????!!!!"

Dr. Muhatir Mohammad is not

Submitted by thunderdial on 8 July, 2007 - 21:28.

Dr. Muhatir Mohammad is not so smart, and had probably never read the Art of War. If you think Ecomonic war works, ask Castro. If ecomonic tactics are the best option, why don't the terrorists use it? You can't argue that the results of a terrorist hit hurts us economically, because every business that matters has a sound BCDR plan, and the investors they want to scare aren't scared any longer, they are pissed.

Just like Islam has been breeding terrorist children, since 9/11, we have been breeding a new generation of Patriot - and I promise you they won't be as politically correct or really give a flying *&$^ about what Islam and the billion of people who have an opinion and live in huts think. A state or a group will cross another line in the sand, the last one, and cities will light up, and insects will not survive.

Think about it - when Bin Laden hit the US, the first thing a very smart man named Tony Blair did was hop on a plane to the US and try to throttle our response. He's a nice guy, and we like him a lot. But the next time will be their last time, I assure you of that. I wouldn't confuse American's frustration with the current situation in Iraq as a signal that we would hestitate to light up their asses in a very significant, meaningful way next time.

You can't stand on a soapbox and call for the complete destuction of the western world, and expect not to know our wrath.

i am glad you think so.....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 8 July, 2007 - 22:08.

you have more faith than i. i think bush should have lit up afganistan and not have gone immediately into iraq. iraq was a good counterbalance to iran.

the militant islam hides behind not wearing uniforms and the knowledge that political correctness has siezed the sick of this country. my god, when they hit, so many said what did we do. you can still see it on this site.

western policy did not create terror, terrorists did.

i like you wmac....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 5 July, 2007 - 18:29.

but we see the same thing and interpret it differently. the christians of 1095 were convert or conquer. that we should both agree on. misguided christians back then. i percieve the militant islamist as the one self described terrorist claims as wanting one world islamic state. i'll buy you a beer in 10 years and the evidence should speak for itself. unless, of course, the one world islamic state does not allow beer. (i already have my prayer rug,) you know the 2 cultures have divergent views on time.

By the way I have never seen

Submitted by wmac on 5 July, 2007 - 18:25.

By the way I have never seen any Iranian in Al-Qaeda or other powerful terrorist organizations. (proven and arrested, you may claim all the terrorist organizations around the world are supported by Iran, and US and specially Israel have never done terrorism nor they support any terrorist organization)

While Iranian people (I mean 95% of normal people , not those hardliners in power) are by no means hardliners, they feel themselves under more attacks from you western countries. This will cause more hardliners to come out from the society.

Then after 3 years do not ask yourself why is that they want to do these things. Everything in nature is "cause and effect".

i agree with that....

Submitted by Che Guevara on 5 July, 2007 - 18:31.

i have read that 75% - 90% of iranians do not support their government.

we all know what Jim would do ...

Submitted by Jinoturistica on 4 July, 2007 - 20:03.

blow away anybody and everything that stands between him and his Diety Given Right to yada yada yada

I was married to a Texan, I had redneck cousins and aunts and sons-in-law. I have seen, heard, suffered from racial bigotry and intolerance. I know what it looks like; the look in the eyes, the frozen half smile, the quick glance at the gun rack, the jump when there is a knock at the door, the way questions are ducked, conversations jump tracks, facts are ignored.

Had this conversation a thousand times. Islam doesn't have a lock on bigoted, uninformed, intolerant society. It lives on even after defeat in the Civil War.

"You can agree with me,

or go to the sem eh tree"

"I wasn't born in Texas, but I left as soon as I could"

Tony X Robins, Jinotega

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