Nicaraguan workers

Submitted by fyl on 29 September, 2006 - 05:46.

This is inspired by Gabriel's post about whether he should return to Nicaragua and do something useful. I say inspired because these are not new thoughts--writing them here is what he inspired.

One of the reasons Nicaragua is the "land of opportunity" is that living is cheap and labor is cheap and available. But, the longer I live here the more I realize that it is only the land of opportunity for a certain type of person. And, more often than not that needed personality characteristic doesn't seem to appear in most Nicaraguans.

There are lots of things we could name this characteristic. Self-motivated. Entrepreneur. ... What I am talking about is both the interest and ability to identify a problem, figure out a solution and take action. This is something I am very good at. The fact that I seldom find a Nicaraguan that is good at this is very frustrating.

I don't want to "give money to Nicaraguans" and I don't want to "employ labor". I want to share my ability to identify and solve problems with Nicaraguans so that they can be "more successful" in the long run without me "helping". I want to now talk about:

  • The problem with an example or two
  • What I mean by "more successful"
  • What to do

The Problem

Probably 2 or 3 times a week I see something that can be easily solved not get solved. This can be as simple as loose screws in the hinge on a cabinet door. The "solution" is to carefully guide the door closed each use. The fact that there is a screwdriver in the next cabinet which could solve the problem is never considered.

My most recent example was that we wanted to plant a garden. But, the soil where we want to plant it is packed clay. I am about to go buy a pick and Ana points out that we have one on the finca and our finca caretaker could come down and turn the soil. (We have sand to add.) Ok, fine. When he arrives I explain the goal and the area.

I go to work. He is gone by the time I go look. The soil is now on huge clumps with lots of rocks. He did exactly what I had asked specifically ignoring the goal. He is not lazy--but this is a typical example of needing to "manage" a project.

More Successful

I need to put this in here so that people don't just see it as meaning "more money" or "a new SUV". We, none of us, want money. We want a better life for us, our family, ... The fact that many people in Nicaragua live on less money than a average electric bill in the US suggests Nicaraguans have a good start. Addressing some basic needs--access to clean water, health care and education, for example--and eliminating other hardships such as being subjected to dangerous agricultural chemicals would be a good thing.

I know many people who live in a rural environment. They work hard to sustain their families. They don't want to move to a city for a "better job" and such a move would not help anyway. Improving their quality of life would be a good thing.

One project I know of here is a low-tech example of doing this. It is a "bicycle well pump". The typical well here is a hand-crank pump. The bicycle pump allows you to use leg power to pump water. Mostly build from scrap, it "helps" with little investment.

What to do?

This is the hard part. When I see someone say "I want a job that does something useful" I am not sure if they are saying:
  I want to figure out what is needed and do it
or, more likely,
  you figure it out and I will work for you.
From what I see, Nicaragua desperately needs more of the former.

I can offer a list of business ideas that will very likely succeed financially and, more important, will either decrease the amount of money that Nicaragua exports or actually import money. I could start one, manage it and make money. But, I couldn't start 2 or 5 or 10 because I don't know where to get people to manage them. To have the necessary vision to analyze and solve the problems of running a business.

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Stonecutter

Submitted by Former NL Member on 5 October, 2006 - 07:09.

I'm pretty sure this ancient parable is public domain:

Once upon a time there was a stonecutter. Each day he went up to the mountains to cut stones. And while he worked he sang, for though he was a poor man, he desired no more than he had, so he had not a care in the world.

One day he was called to work on the mansion of a nobleman. When he saw the magnificence of the mansion, he experienced the pain of desire for the first time in his life and he said with a sigh, "If only I were rich! Then I would not have to earn my living in sweat and toil as I do now."

Imagine his astonishment when he heard a voice say, "Your wish has been granted. Henceforth, anything you desire will be given to you." He did not know what to make of the words till he returned to his hut that evening and found in its place a mansion as magnificent as the one he had been working on. So the stonecutter gave up cutting stones and began to enjoy the life of the rich.

One day when the afternoon was hot and humid, he happened to look out his window and saw the King go by with a large retinue of noblemen and slaves. He thought, "How I wish I were a King myself, sitting in the cool of the royal carriage!" His wish was promptly carried out and he found himself reclining in the comfort of the royal carriage. But the carriage turned out to be warmer than he had assumed it to be. He looked out of the carriage window and began to marvel at the power of the sun, whose heat could penetrate even the thick walls of the carriage. "I wish I were the sun," he said to himself. Once again his wish was granted and he found himself sending out waves of light and heat into the universe.

All went well for a while. Then on a rainy day, he attempted to pierce through a thick bank of clouds and could not. So he got himself changed into a cloud and glorified in his power to keep the sun away -- till he turned into rain and found, to his annoyance, a mighty rock that blocked his path so he was obliged to flow around it.

"What?" he cried. "A mere rock more powerful than I? Well, then I wish to be a rock." So there he was standing tall upon a mountainside. He barely had time to rejoice in his fine figure, however, when he heard strange clipping sounds proceeding from his feet. He looked down and, to his dismay, found a tiny human being sitting there engaged in cutting chunks of stone from his feet.

"What?" he shouted. "A puny creature like that more powerful than an imposing rock like me? I want to be a man!" So he found he was once again a stonecutter going up into the mountain to cut stone, earning his living in sweat and toil but with a song in his heart because he was content to be what he was and to live by what he had.

correct assesment of resources-

Submitted by dodgese on 3 October, 2006 - 09:18.

You need to be an SOB to make another SOB do your work. This is accomplished with......

Initiative-The only means to an end.

Communication-Correct and thorough communications saves time with thorough delegation. any disruption, assumption or incorrect communication cuts down on resources.

Correct identification of resources-(human,time,services and materials)

Training -Human resources are your most valuable assets ,They are the easiest assets to improve.

Experience-Experience makes your human resources double your delegative power.

Reward & recognition-Without properly using this, your resources may dwindle/

From a hints and tips book for X-com:Apocalypse by Microprose.

Interesting

Submitted by gjb2101 on 2 October, 2006 - 08:24.

These recent posts have been quite interesting to me. While I think that Carina's views may be somewhat true, there are obviously always exceptions to the norm. You'll find people in the US just as lazy and unmotivated as any Nicaraguan (albeit, there are more in poorer countries). But, there are a small growing number of hard-working, intelligent people in Nicaragua. The hard part is finding them and getting involved in some way.

Gabriel

Lazy is not the issue

Submitted by fyl on 2 October, 2006 - 09:30.

While I did feel that was true in Costa Rica (where they import Nicas to do the work) I find few lazy people here. What I do find are mostly people who don't "think outside the box". That is a common US expression and I would expand it to say, for most Nicaraguans, the box is smaller.

That is, if dad supported the family with the farm, Jr. may well see that as the only option. If dad worked as a bricklayer, Jr. may well see that as the only option. But, even beyond this, that "ability to invent" that Carina talks about is what I see as the whole problem.

Again, it isn't being lazy--it is just not being "programmed" to think about the better way. I see this with my wife. She has an agronomy degree. She has been planting stuff in our finca. What stuff: red beans, potatoes, tomatoes and corn. In other words, what everyone else plants.

When I ask about growing garbanzos, herbs, sesame, ... her answers were "we only learned about corn, beans, coffee, ... in school". In other words, she was trained to keep doing what is being done. While someone needs to grow the beans and corn, I see the potential in other crops--either for local use or export.

Yesterday we bought two 14oz bags of garbanzos for about C$42/bag. Red beans cost about C$5/lb. I asked if we could grow garbanzos on the finca and she felt we could. But, she said people here didn't eat them. Well, we do as a start and everyone I have fed various garbanzo things to (including gallo pinto) has liked them.

Growing some might turn Estelí into the middle eastern food capital of Nicaragua. Probably not but, if nothing else, we can get garbanzos to eat for a lot less than about C$50/lb.

Thus, we don't need more Nicaraguan workers and I don't even think there is a local problem with what we can call foreman. What is needed is someone with "business vision".

This is a very interesting thread....

Submitted by Pompano Tom on 4 October, 2006 - 06:42.

and one I have thought about as well.

My conclusion is that a culture must have a sense of upward mobility. And I believe that that is the one aspect of life in the USA that makes the USA so great.

Anyone can be anything they want! Our past president, Mr. Clinton is a good example of that. His beginnings were very modest and he went on to become a Rhodes Scholar and eventually the most powerful man in the world. Some trip!

I think that the USA evolved without a lot of baggage such as Royalty, Castes, and religious involvement in government. So, we were all a bunch of mongrels, looking to better our lot and decided that the best man should win, regardless of parentage (please, no GW tirades).

Of course, there are many other parts of a culture that must be in place, such as freedom, democracy, education, etc. but a clear sense of upward mobility is paramount.

I believe that if an individual can solve a problem with an understanding that he can better his lot by taking advantage of his ingenuity, then there will be many more individuals solving many more problems.

Now how do you go about instilling this in a culture? This will take generations, of course. But a true democracy is primary. Second is elimination of corruption (probably the hardest of all to change as it is often a deep rooted part of the culture). Third is education and lofty goal setting by teachers and parents. Educate the students on the value of democracy and the importance that corruption is bad and not allowed.

Forty, maybe fifty years.

Goal

Submitted by carina_cisneros on 1 October, 2006 - 23:41.

A lot can be learned by looking at people's goals. Many people in Latin America, havent any real goals, in the sense of what people in Western countries have (partly this is realism, partly fatalism). Of course, people want money, to spend money, but that is completely different from really wanting to earn money, or building something which might guarantee money long term. Much of what you describe can be thought of as inventions. Solutions are small inventions. Latin America is not famous for its inventors (quick, name 3 Panamanian inventors?). People do not think the same way as do people from entreprenuerial countries. If you were a guy sitting in Denver, and you saw another guy making good money building some thing, "X", it might occur to you that you could build "X" for less, or built "X" much better. Someone who thinks like this thinks like a problem solver. Most people in Latin America would never try to do something better (what is the point if people already buy the half ass thing?) or do so for less (why sell for less, making less money?). People copy, badly usually. That is about all they do. It usually does not even matter if the thing copied sucks. The easy route is the route taken. If a man makes moeny building some device with imported parts, many people would never consider importing their own parts and trying to make a better thing. It would not enter their mind, especially since you can hijack the other guy's parts parts from the port and sell them back to him, or blackmail him! If you ever find the people to manage the 2-5-10 project you could start, my guess is that if they are the kind of people you really want or need, they were educated outside of Latin America, or were higher level former employees of foreign owned outfits.

Right on

Submitted by fyl on 2 October, 2006 - 07:11.

A few years ago a friend in Costa Rica commented on how you needed a Tico that has lived outside of CR for a while if you wanted someone that "would work". I agreed with his conclusion but hadn't thought about why.

I feel like you just answered the why part. Thanks.

Yankees & Germans

Submitted by carina_cisneros on 3 October, 2006 - 01:07.

Several times in the last 10 years or so I have seen public Latin peoples address or acknowledge exactly what you are describing. Each time it is sort of a little bit of torture to watch cause it is a little embarrassing, even if mostly true. I photographed a graduation ceremony in the best private school in Honduras, where the graduation speaker at ones point refered to a future in which Hondurans would maybe have good inventive capabilities. He acknowledged that for decades or evens centuries they were mere workers, but that in the future they would be yankees (the speech was partly in English, perhaps to entertain the U.S. Ambassador, whose Spanish was not very good?). What he meant was that eventually Hondurans would have "Yankee ingenuity", but that is not how it came out. People in the Latin world often associate really, really good ideas with foreigners (if all most people do is sell Chinese made crap, knowing things made elsewhere are 10x better, why not assume this?). People often associate quality with foreigners. I know several North American and Dutch people in Central America whose employees simply assume their bosses are German, for no other reason than their work and product standards. In Honduras and Guatemala is not not uncommon for people to quip "what are you, German?" anytime someone criticizes the work or quality of what they just did. The assumption is that no Latin would complain that the corner of the building or table or picture frame or whatever isnt even close to 90 degrees! Underneath it all though is an obvious respect for people who have diverse knowledge and ideas. It might be more envy than ignorance which leads to certain uncomfortable conversations.

Times change

Submitted by Jack Davies on 3 October, 2006 - 23:18.

China was far ahead of the rest of the world with their inventions such as gunpowder at one time. Then they kind of dropped out of the limelight. Now after sending their children to U.S. universities they are starting to become productive again. The Arabs were far ahead of the rest of the world with mathematics and engineering until they bogged down with Mohamedism. I haven't noticed too much coming from that direction since. War and the space program have fostered most of the West's latest discoveries. At the moment a lot of the new breakthroughs are coming out of Israel. Who knows whose next.

JD you hit the nail on the head

Submitted by toms on 4 October, 2006 - 04:42.

Mr.Steve loaned me a book about people cultures and places and the arab world florished unreal before mohammand twisted tha thinking of its people.

I think it is not wheather people are actually free but at least it is the frame of mind that gives way to such creativness that the sky is the limit to what can be accomplished. Yes I belive freedom is a state of mind. we all have to pay for things in life nothing is free

Why did Chavez reduce the gift of free fuel and put conditions?

Lyin' Farmer John Wayne

yeah well

Submitted by teeoneup on 30 September, 2006 - 12:25.

at least they do not lie about the job and say you told them wrong and you still owe them more $ like ticos.

jalaluyah

I wanted to meet you in person in my last trip to Esteli...!

Submitted by nicoya on 29 September, 2006 - 10:02.

As a Nica de cepa myself, I agree with most of your post.

My grandfather, before the Sandinistas ruined his life in 1,980, used to manage hundreds of workers during coffee season. He had an extraordinary talent to make people do exactly what he wanted. He was both feared and admired because of it. For him to be such an effective communicator meant he knew his people well. The fact that he also came from the people, gave him a great advantage. I remember stories about his younger years (as told by Grandma!) how he was the first one up in the morning and the last one to go to bed, and how Grandma had to forcedly drag the man to bed from his end-of-day duties of making sure all the doors and fences were locked up properly. I know she succeeded because together they had eight children  .

Yes, the average - Nica - worker has an attitude of “I am not supposed to think, I just what I’m told”. Whenever a project failed, my grandpa never ever blame the worker (ok, maybe once or twice but only when he missed his morning coffee and stuff, the man had a temper I’d tell you). He’d blame his foreman and then himself. He faced, in a daily basis, similar problems as you describe; so he developed a method of getting his message across like no other. Please note that I noticed you did not blame your finca worker either.

I don’t know how to turn someone into a problem solver; I would only hope that that with education and training things would improve. An immediate and more manageable way to deal with it is for you, the problem solver, to become better at communicating with others (easier said than done with the obvious challenges you have yourself).

BTW, thanks for reminding me, one of my doors has a loose hinge and just remember that I do have a screwdriver somewhere in the house…no biggie .. I’ll be back…

Inventions and working

Submitted by Jack Davies on 4 October, 2006 - 19:52.

I watched a man making knives in a little village in the high Atlas in Morocco. He had a round metal stake sticking up out of the ground for an anvil and he was heating metal for the knives in an open fire with no bellows. He was using any kind of old metal that he could find to make knives and spear heads. I still have two spears that he made out of old truck u-bolts.

I had a small box trap for years that I brought home from Mexico. Some kid had made it out of an oil can, some spring wire and a little wood. It was a very clever design and it worked great. Pay attention when you are looking around in Nicaragua and you will probably run into some examples and you will have to admit that some of the old skills passed down through the years are pretty tricky. Just try your hand at making one of those little clay pots using a kick-wheel.

Years ago Ford Motor Company decide it would try to help out with the unemployment problem in Detroit. They hired some of the young blacks from the ghetto. Most of them didn't show up at work so Ford started sending cars around to pick them up in the morning. That didn't work either so they gave up on the idea. You can't take someone who didn't even have to get up to go to school, and expect them to change that quickly. People have to be exposed to better habits while they are still young. Someone who is used to getting up every day at 10 am or latter to go down to the pool room is going to have a hard time getting up at 5 am. to go to work.