Sex on the Edge

Sorry about the title. I thought long and hard and just didn't get a good one. This isn't about "sex tourism" and not specifically about "underage sex". It's about that grey area that seems to appear all too often.

Now, I have been told the age of consent in Nicaragua is 18. That means, in U.S. terms, if you are over 18 and the person you have sex with is under 18, that is statuetory rape. There is no such thing as consent. Of course, the reality here is likely very different. Such "rules" just aren't likely to be considered in rural Nicaragua (or most other places in the western world).

Ok, that said, here are three "case studies". All involve an older male (in three of the four cases, from the United States) and a younger Nicaraguan. The only one getting named here is me.

Me: Grumpy fifty-something Gringo and a Nicaraguan woman less than half my age. It isn't something I would have even considered but it just "evolved". We are married and many of her family members including her mother are pretty much here daily. We consider each other equals and most people who observe us seem to agree. The exception is one person who thinks she is totally in charge.

Person A: Fifty-something Gringo with woman less than half his age. She is clearly not "sweet and innocent" and has/has had other lovers. They don't live together. It sorta looks like "just sex" on both sides.

Person B: Thirty-something Gringo with woman under 18. Living together but, at least on his end, there doesn't really seem to be committment. She is pregnant.

Person C: Twenty-something Nicaraguan male with a 15 year old Nicaraguan female. I lack any details here but it is another current "situation".

The law says the first two are ok and the last two are illegal. I know people that would say the first and fourth are ok and the other two are not. I know people that would say they are all bad and others that would say they are all ok.

Where is the right place to draw the line? And, well, why?

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Sex over 65

Watch out for those older gringos.

http://www.local6.com/news/9283707/detail.html

Sexual Tourism

Article in today's La Prensa...yes Phil, i spent 2 minutes and got signed up and was able to read this article without buying the physical newspaper.

www-ni.laprensa.com.ni/archivo/2006/mayo/26/noticias/sucesos/119704.shtml

Seems a Polish guy (31 years, not your normal 55 year old pervert!) goes to Granada's Central Park and offers a 13 year old girl selling chewing gum 20 dollars...and not for chewing gum. They go to an "auto hotel" called Los Faroles and she shakes her moneymaker. Later the mother denounces the Polish guy to the Police, but the mother then drops the case as it seems the Polish "gentleman" gave her $300 to buy rice and beans... Seems like mummy was setting up a nice little busy... Now, who is to blame'? Mummy, Mr. Polaco...poverty? Maybe the Polaco was real ugly or really perverted because in Granada one can obtain nice 20 year old girls who will go to a motel with you for $20...i haven't, honest!!

[Content below this point was deleted for violation of international copyright law, please follow the provided link above to read this story see the bottom of http://www.nicaliving.com/node/1571 for the policy of this site before posting copyright material]

he got lucky

he could have spent years in jail or thousands of $$$$$ to get charges dropped.

A few years ago, in Esteli, there were a few teenagers, purposely targeting foreigners to have sex with them, for money or no money, to later black mail them, saying they got rapped, Double wammy, under aged and rape!! They WILL linch you for that in some boondock places I know in Nicaragua.

I have seen that here too

Even Locals were targeted, if they were known to have a few bucks.

And off goes Moma with her new riches, happy as a pig in you know what, never thinking about the childs future, or mental, or physical health.

There are laws but almost NEVER inforced in cases like this.

I know one man who was the 3rd local person to pay the mother 10,000 cordobas, and without a doubt it was staged.

The shame of it is the mother goes absolutely free.

Farmer John Wayne

SEX

That's a difficult question, leaving legality aside because in England from which many laws of many democracies are derived, and in the early days of most democracies, females were married and bearing children by the time they were 14 or 15 years old to men just a bit older or a whole lot older than they. I don't know enough history to know just when that practice became socially and legally unacceptable but, again, leaving legality aside, I think 'consent' in its almost archaic form meaning 'to be of the same mind' should be the defining factor in sexual or most other non-adversarial relationships. In other words, if a 16 year old male or female is of the same mind about sexual congress as another 16 year old male or female or as a 36 or 56 year old male or female, good! But I think it is not possible that a 16 or a 38 year old male or female who is mentally retarded or socially stunted to 'consent' to enter into sexual congress with another person who is not of the same mind.

In fact the world might be a better place if people without minds didn't have sex at all, especially unprotected sex where the possibility of another candidate for a Darwin award might be visited upon us.

people without minds

That's it Big Al, no more sex for you! You lost you're mind a long time ago!

HUMOR

I do hope that second paragraph was taken for the joke I intended. Any human who has watched the movie 'Osama' would think long and hard about sex without consent.

Drawing the line

For me it is not a question of where to draw the line but why, if there is a law, would it be ok to break it?

If #1 and #2 are ok by law and #3 and #4 are not then I feel the line has been drawn.

I might expect this from a non-Nicaraguan

I know people in the US that feel "the law is the law". Well, except for the things they hedge on such as speed limits, declaring income from selling their dog's puppies on their income tax and such. And they also tend to except that rich people have different laws. But, in Nicaragua, where things are more "equal" that is a surprising statement.

Beyond that, the way laws get changed is by people taking action. For example, up until maybe 20 years ago there was a law on the books in Oregon that if you brought your horse to school, it was the responsibility of the school to supply a food and water for him. Someone did bring their horse to school and demanded that in the 1980s. The law got changed.

I was looking for responses about the "social issues" here. As for the legal ones, I expect most people would consider 18 as the age of consent to be rather absurd and would also consider laws that are absolute about age rather than possibly addressing age differences (something like the age of consent is 18 for anyone more than 2 years older than the other person but consenting sex is always ok if the age difference is less than two years--or whatever).

kids and sex

Does This Book make sense to anybody?

Or is it an endorsement of pedophilia?

And This Association?

Should kids drive cars, too? Drink alcohol? Vote?

The book makes sense

This book is similar to the book I wrote on drug use called "Drugs: Facts Behind the Rumors". (Note that eventually I will have the book re-typed in and will make it available for free on-line.)

The similarity is that in both cases, if we tell kids "just say no" then they see these "adult things" as special and they want to explore more. And, particularly in the case of drugs, if we lie to them about relative dangers and they find out they were lied to, they are more likely to not heed other warnings. In the case of drugs this lie is generally along the lines of the generic statement "legal drugs are safe but illegal drugs are not".

Though I haven't read the book, I don't think it encourages pedophilia but, rather, suggests that kids need to be aware of the realities of sex, sexual relations and sexual abuse. Most sexual abuse of minors happens with family members--not the dirty old man down the street. Kids need to be prepared to "figure things out" rather than get a "the family is good/the stranger is bad" sales pitch.

Along these lines, when a friend of mine's daughter was about 14, my friend (who is a woman) gave her a "if you want to have sex" lesson that surprised me. My friend said, "If and when you decide to have sex with someone, I encourage you to bring him home with you. Why? Because, if you get in a situation you don't like, you are in a much better position to get out of it than if you were in the back seat of a car in the woods."

What happened? Her daughter finally (I think she was 17) decided to have sex with a guy. They would come home, talk to her mom (and me if I was there) and go off to bed. A year or so later, she married him.

If that had been my daughter, I don't know if I could have made that statement. But, it made sense and it clearly paid off.

Ncaraguas Laws.

B&C could definately get you some jail time.

Adulthood test?

I've always thought it was strange that a guy over 18 can't have sex with a girl under 18, but if two kids under 18 have sex, everyone giggles, hands them a condom and says, "they're gonna do it anyway." And no one gets arrested.

Maybe you should have to pass a test, like getting a drivers license.

Case in point

From the U.S. "Virgin" Islands, a high school sophmore and junior were filmed by a classmate's cell phone doing "it" in the classroom. An adult's voice is heard on the recording. From the news story, no one seems to be in any rush to prosecute anyone.

Rumor in Puerto Cabezas

First of all, I not involved or looking for any female because I am very happily married to a wonderful Miskito woman.

The town-talk in Puerto Cabezas is that if a girl is under 18 and already has a baby - She becomes automatically of legal age.

I have no idea about the laws of Nicaragua regarding this tale.

Miskito Alan &#174

????

- wick

Yeah

The tale my mom told me sounds alike.

Her story was that a girl is not a "girl" but a woman after losing her virginity willingly and she's a whore after giving birth to a child ( willingly ) but that there's nothing wrong with male or female being a whore as long as he/she is a good one and not a cheap one.

Good and expensive whores are respected - treated as such, bad and cheap whores are direspected - again, treated as such.

I think the unconveyed message there was to not be afraid of your sexual origin or preference. You think maybe she could have just taught me some great life skills directed to women? Or maybe those are the great life skills directed to Nicaraguan women.

P.S.

Be very careful not to treat a good whore like a bad whore...

...although it's OK to treat a bad whore like a good whore.

Nicaraguans supposedly look down on incompetent work and any work done out of desperation.

I’m sure it was someone here in Nicaragua that warned me: “It’s all about appearances”. My mother never would have relayed that message to me. We never got that close and our opinions clashed almost daily.

I can’t wait to return and drive her crazier now that I’ve finally arrived to Nicaragua and blew her cover. It’s a Nicaragua-thing, I learned it from her. I’m sure she’s looking forward to it too :-).

Fingers Twitching

Im dying to ask you a question but I'll leave it alone because I dont want to insult you, Im lauging pretty hard though, thinking about the question and what your reaction might be. These are one of those examples of "Opening a can of worms", but Ill be good.

Please, be bad.

I haven't had much luck by way of excitement thus far since arriving in Nicaragua, just disappointments by way of impostors, amateurs and tricks any normally-healthy child could catch .

I'll only be insulted if you turn out to be another disappointment.

You're also welcomed to PM me if you'd prefer to save face.