Ortega support China and Russia on Position about Siria


What does it mean? At least he is consistent in his support for strange causes like Whaling, Iran, now Siria, etc.

In other news: http://www.elnuevodiario.com.ni/politica/241417-ortega-saluda-aniversari... I do not really think he knows what the revolution in Iran was all about? Now, most Iranians i know reminisce about the times of the Shah.

Reminds me of the "Contrary" in Little Big Man movie.

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x who the hell is ortega? ortega is always supporting those crazy funks.

i wonder when will nicargua be free, when?

Crazy world politics

I think this is about the right place to toss this into the discussion. This is the first part of an article in the Los Angeles Times.

U.S. and NATO soldiers have been ordered to take extraordinary precautions against being shot by Afghan troops, including designating “guardian angels” to keep watch at joint bases around the clock, according to a senior military official.

Any time a group of Western soldiers is gathered on a joint base to exercise, train or even sleep, one member of the unit is required to be armed and on alert for possible fratricide attacks, the official said, describing the new requirement.

So you think Ortega hooks up with strange governments. I think the US forces itself on strange governments.

The US creates strange governments

The CIA worked with the fundamentalist Afghans and foreign fighters to overthrow a moderate left Afghani government that asked the USSR for help. They get rid of the Russians but the moderate left group held on to Kabul longer than the US puppet forces held onto Saigon. The CIA-sponsored group turns into the Taliban, proving yet again that the enemy of my enemy might also hate me, too, just getting rid of enemy no 2 before attacking enemy no 1.

Nobody quite knows how involved the Taliban ever was with al Qaeda. The Taliban is still a popular enough force in Afghanistan that anyone trying to put together a government for Afghanistan has to deal with them.

Rebecca Brown

It looks freer than the US to me

...just that big employers and landlords are no longer free to call in the Guardia to beat someone into accepting the wage they want to pay.

Rebecca Brown

Looks can be deceptive.

Define 'Free' as it pertains to the average Nicaraguan or the 'Real Nicaraguans'.

When the Nicaraguan veterans can protest by seizing a bridge

and there's no violence, no beating them down, just negotiations, it beat the US record for handling its own vets after WW I, and those didn't seize the bridges going into DC, either.

You've never lived in the US, especially not in South Carolina in the 1950s and early 1960s. I can't buy a freedom that's just for rich white people.

And right now, I'm rather embarrassed for at least some of my country, though there's been some effort to make it illegal to stalk black men and shoot them because they were new to the neighborhood.

People here get killed when they declare that they're picking up the gun to fight the duly elected government. It seems an improvement over killing them because they have a mass rally against the government.

Didn't say it was perfect. No place is, but the US shouldn't be as bad as it is considering how wealthy it is.

Rebecca Brown

So freedom for you is all about violence...

The average Nicaraguan can't "buy a freedom that's just for rich white people" either.

Assuming you have noticed that the country's elite is mostly white and a blend of about 6 family names that keep it that way.

There's a lot more to freedom than not getting shot.

You see the freedom you want and can afford to see.

I've noticed that, and noticed two family names

that show up the most, including buying themselves a politician and some folks to show up at their pet politician's rally here. And the Chomorros show up a lot, too. The other three names, I haven't noticed as much yet, but there are also some local rich folks names here, too.

Most Southern US states have their own five or six family names that manage to stay on top regardless (Reynolds family has been doing well for close to two centuries now in aluminium and tobacco plus diversification). The population is just larger and the economy more developed. Try living in a place where who your people are defines you -- that's not just for Nicaragua.

Rockefellers, DuPonts show up in several states, and one DuPont thought he was beyond being arrested for murder (turns out he wasn't in the right state to get away with it).

I've noticed that Ortega is described as looking Chorotegan.

I don't see protesting over unkept promises to be violent.

Rebecca Brown

Gotta agree with him

Syria is, well, none of our business. Let me say the same for Iran. In fact, I just watched a short video blog by Foster of Thrive Movement that makes the game all the more interesting. It turns out that the USS Enterprise, currently deployed near Iran, is ancient and due to be decomissioned next year. That makes it a potential candidate for a false flag event (like the Tonkin Gulf indecent was the one used to get the US into a war in Vietnam). And the story (of bringing democracy to people using weapons) goes on.

Oh yeah

The US got into Vietnam thru the feeble mind of one Harry S. Truman and every president who followed him till 1975. Same Harry Truman of Palestine and Korea fame. Too bad FDR died so soon and his ``get the Midwest votes`` dummy took over..

"You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality." Ayn Rand

The US got into a lot of places because

...the theory (see State Department archives) was that if we or the Brits didn't control less developed countries, they'd be under some other less benevolent empire (like the French, considering that they slaughtered Ho Chi Minh's family when they couldn't get him).

Roosevelt resisted more than most, but most prior administrations were playing (see the Philippines, which the Japanese took from the US and which became an actual democracy only in 1986, freed from direct US or Japanese control in 1946.

A number of Vietnamese nationalists only played with the VCP because it was the best organized group fighting colonialism. Nothing like highly disciplined cadres for getting things done in war time, just not necessarily the best governments for peace time.

Presidents like FDR are rare. And people are still trashing Lincoln for wanted to suspend habeus corpus but suspending habeus corpus is allowed under the Constitution during times of rebellion and war.

Rebecca Brown

You blew it

Now that you have gone live they can`t use this ship. The crew thanks you.

"You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality." Ayn Rand

What about an Italian boat?

They could just tip it over and say Iran did it.


“It's hard to argue against cynics - they always sound smarter than optimists because they have so much evidence on their side”

Mary Tyler "Molly" Ivins

. .Now, most Iranians i know

Yeah, me too, but these were Iranians who fled the revolution.

That's why we know them!

Pretty decent people, as I suspect most Iranians are.

The problem is the extremist fruitcakes running the country. A nuclear weapon only has value to a rogue state with nothing to lose. No reputable state is going to use the nuclear option.

Even if Iran hands a nuclear weapon to one of its proxies, everyone will know where it came from. Iran will continue to be marginalized.

Interesting coming from an Idahoan, I thought that you

were talking about the USA. You know, atomic bomb bullies that have a "Pre~Emptive First Strike" policy. And, we are the only's to have actually dropped two atomic bombs on helpless/defenseless civilian populations. (Due to Nevada's above ground atomic explosions, Idahoans have a very high incidence of cancers ~ hence, my wonder ) That glass house is clear "pain" to all other countries that live in our shadow. Yes, shadow ~ not light. The extremist fruitcakes are....whom? And, "No reputable state...." er, the USA has that very history? The top side of the teeter ~ totter; because we have all the "conventional" advantage is saying, "How dare they....use whatever they have left available to them to resist this Empire's wishes?" Think David and the G man...?

It's Been A

very long time since a nuclear weapon has been used. Whether the US was justified in using that option in Japan, and the choice of targets, is still hotly debated. Some claim it saved Japanese lives, compared to a conventional end to the war with Japan. The conventional bombing of Tokyo claimed more lives than Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined. Certainly it saved many American lives. It was a different time; I think you might have had to have been there to understand the rationale and the context. Some blame has to be laid at the feet of the Japanese leadership for continuing the war after it was clear that they had been defeated.

My point in my earlier post was, no reputable or sane state would use a nuclear device today. That leaves Pakistan, and potentially, Iran, as two countries that might detonate a device.

Fruitcakes?? Well, Iran has vowed the destruction of Israel by any means. They've accepted a casualty figure of 90 million Iranians as acceptable to that end.

The insidious devastation caused by the above-ground testing (which ceased in 1962) and the manufacture of plutonium at Hanford (which is slowly being remediated), is unquestioned. My father died of leukemia in his mid-sixties, as a result (we believe) of his career in the Air Force as "Nuclear Accident First Responder". He trained with the devices, and people simply were not cognizant of the risks involved until recently.

I believe that we ARE moving towards a world free of nuclear weapons. I believe that the weapons no longer serve a purpose.

In the meantime we still have some very dangerous people out there. 911 was a tiny taste of what would be possible if a nuclear weapon fell into the wrong hands. View the pictures of the destruction of Hiroshima and transfer that to NYC.

What the US doesn't get

...is that most people of the world would like it to stay out of their internal affairs.

When we invaded Iraq, my father, who talked to old men who'd fought for the Confederacy despite thinking slavery was not something they liked, said that no matter how much Iraqis hated Saddam Hussein, they'd hate the US more.

Basically, I suspect that there's a significant minority, perhaps a majority of Iranians who would like to be more secular without it being under a US puppet.

My father wasn't opposed to Iraq changing its government, just opposed bitterly to the US wading in to do it.

40% of the US population isn't happy with the way the US is ruled, either. I think we'd all be equally up at arms if the EU marched in to help us, even those of us who think the Western European nations have lot saner domestic and international policies.

Rebecca Brown