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Nicaraguans Flee Nicaragua in drovesSubmitted by will305 on 27 July, 2008 - 21:15.
I found a very well researched article in Wikipedia that states "The largest concentration of Nicaraguan Americans, about 79,559, is in Miami, Florida, most notably around the "Little Managua" area." While I already knew there were many Nicaraguans living in Miami, having a home in Miami near Sweetwater, I was unaware of the magnitude of this mass exodus. The article also discusses some of the motivations for such immigration and some members might find it enlightening. I personally can't understand why so many have abandoned their country instead of trying to stay and help like so many gringo immigrants are trying to do. There is also a long list of "famous" Nicarguan Americans, althought the only one I have heard of is Dennis Martinez. Read it here: ( categories: )
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Part of My Story
I am a proud Canadian who was born in Managua in '79. My mother fled the country leaving behind family, friends and her own little house in Villa Libertad which she worked so hard to buy. She escaped via Honduras - Guatemala and eventually made it to Canada. I love Canada. It is my home. I have not forgotten where I came from nor will I ever. Canada has given me the opportunity of a life of freedom, education and has taught me the meaning of community and charity. My family was neither for those Sandinista fools nor the contras. They just wanted to live in peace. Yet they were taken advantage by both sides. There lands and cattle were taken for "people". I do hold resentment towards some Nicaraguans (those hard core sandis and contras) for what they have caused and the state that they have kept the people in. For those who accuse us of being "creidos" for not wanting to go back.....I have tasted freedom and my no means do I want to be under a socialist regime. Many nica's here were sadden and angered when they heard that Daniel Ortega was elected. I will be visiting Nicaragua soon with my wife and 10 year old son. I look forward to meeting my family and my people. I want my son to see where he is coming from and not to forget his roots. He is excited about the trip. Las night he asked me if he was going to be able to see some animals, I leaned over to my wife and wispered "if he only new he will most likely be sleeping with them"...my wife and I had a really good laugh while our son stared at us and wondered what was so funny. I wish to post more, but I will wait to respond to comments....if any.
Your not kidding bigmac.
Your not kidding bigmac. When we got married back in Jan. 05 my wife and I spent the saecond part of our honey-moon in an old family owned house in El Tuma. A small town about an hour north of Matagalpa. To our surprise, even to the wife who by the way is Nic but lived and grew up in the city of Matagalpa, to find horses parked on the front porch chickens, pigs, dogs running though the house and yet a nother horse in the back yard but even more intertianing was THE BAT. Yes THE BAT that terrorized us the better part of the night as we tried to get some much needed sleep. Too much meet and greet with family and friends had worn us right out. The story of THE BAT and all his barn yard friends is now legendary on both sides of the family now. Ya they are still laughing about it.;)
That is a funny story Marnica
When my wife went back for the first time she stayed at her old house (grandma's) in Managua. She was so tired from the long flight that she went directly to sleep. During the night she kept hearing a chirping sound near her ear. She never gave it a second thought as to what it was since it sounded like a birdl. In the morning she inquired about the birds. Their reponse was "what birds"? Next night the same chirping began, she decided to turn on the lights and to her terror the chirping in her ears was from a Gecos (she is utterly disgusted and horrified by reptiles) who were running up and down the walls. She screamed. Woke everyone. and they all laughed at her.
CHIRPING GECKOS A GIFT FROM SOVIET SHIPS
The damn gecko is a reminder of piricuaco ties to the Soviet Union. According to local lore, the animal was brought in the soviet ships that were carrying weapons for the piricuacos.
When I first returned to Nicaragua, I saw this strange pink lizard who made a sucking/chirping sound.
This animal is non-native and has infested the entire country.
http://www.vianica.com/animals/reptiles/lizards/48
Wikipedia
Wikipedia is not an official site for definitions but is thought as such.
Wikipedia is a site that is updated by individuals, not experts. At one time there was a listing for Miskito Alan Beer.
You can add what ever you want and hopefully someone will come along and correct mistakes made by lunes.
Exactly
Wikipedia tends to be, after a "settling time" a very reliable source of information. If you go to a popular Wikipedia page are read the "talk" page you will see why. This is where changes/problems are discussed. Sure, sometimes, there will be a "Miskito Alan Beer" entry added but the combination of standards and a lot of participation tends to correct these problems quickly.
This is much like why Linux gets bugs fixed while Windoze gets bugs "marketed around". (BTW, Wikipedia runs on Linux systems—just like Google.)
But
I forgot to mention this in my post. Wikipedia IS the first place I go to when needing a definition, then I do a little more research to follow it up.
Makes on think....
How is it any different to have Nicaraguans leave their country because of being forced to serve in the army compared to US citizens who left for Canada during Vietnam?
To me?
Not much difference at all.
A notable percentage of
A notable percentage of those listed were born in America. To me, that makes them American.
I guess my real question or point was....
Why does it continue and why don't they come back? We have Nicaraguan American members on this board, for example, who seem to be very angry with the way things are going in Nicaragua (not you, Hugo or Snake). Why don't they come back and try to do something to change things? Isn't that the way change happens, by becoming involved and effectuating change for the better? The ones who have stayed in the US and are happy, good for them (Snake, Hugo?). I imagine they have found happiness and success and are not really motivated to come back. My reference is to those who don't seem to be happy and complain regularly about the state of affairs and particularly the involvement of "foreigners" who they seem to blame for all the countries troubles, which is obviously unfounded. Just a point for discussion...
very very few
of us Have Come Backafter the 80's exodus, and ARE doing things to help our people and the country,by providing jobs and working with the community to improve things. I really believe some of us Nicas need to do more than B.S talk and take action or STFU.
I get pissed off when some of my own people who fled the SMP(on which I served 3 months and luckily survived)talk all kinds of crap about Nicaraguans current situation and yet they are still sitting pretty in the U.S.A.
Now I know sending money to our loved ones left behind helps,but that is NOT enough to help change things of make an impact at a grander scale. I find it even harder to believe that quite a few thousand Nicaraguans did not even go to Nicaragua to vote for those paisanos,I have NO respect for,those that are not legal yet I understand,Those that could have gone and did not and talk shit about the current pedazo de caca of government we have "Shut the Fuck up",You should not say a single word,since you could have changed things but you did not take action. FAP
Those of us who can actually afford to live comfortably
Those of us who can actually afford to live comfortably in the US have no need to go back except for vacationing and visiting family. We still send money to our families and donate to Nicaraguan charities (I hope).
Besides, Nicaragua in the 70's and 80's had no need for people like us. They killed, imprisoned, and exiled many. That goes for Somoza and the Sandinistas.
It's mostly those who can no longer afford it here (US, EEUU)that go stretch their dollars and go to places like Nicaragua so they can have a nice life. I guarantee most of those people aren't helping their families abroad.
Nacistes pinolero, indio, te vas a morir pinolero indio hueputa!
Those who have such luxury in the US do not have need for Nicaragua. I am fed up with Nicaraguan who forget where they come from. I am fed up with Nicaraguans who do not even want to speak their language anymore. I know of many that talk about Nicaraguans as if they were never one of them, as if they turned into a blond hair- blue eyed grigo all of a sudden. Not so say that those features are bad. What is stupid though is to be someone you are not. Nacistes Pinolero, Indio, te vas a morir pinolero Indio hueputa!!! I wish that the ones that have no need for nicaragua would never go there.I do not want to see you stuck up people in Nicaragua. Do not go to Nicaragua to show off your us dollars and then come here and talk your garbage. I came to this country at 10. 14 years later I yearn to be in my home land. This is where I will die. I am proud of who I am and most of all I am proud of my heritage. The whole point of getting an education here is so I can go back to my country and do something for my people. If we did not have so many shameful Nicaraguans who become too good for Nicaragua, our country would not be so poor. It is a shame that there is more help from foreigners in Nicaragua than there is help from Nicaraguan's theselves.
Speaking of language
I know what puta means. What does hueputa mean? at the same time what does pinolero mean? Sorry, I am trying to learn Spanish. and I would rather not guess.
ideay?
ideay?
P.S. U from the Sco too! We practically neighbors. I'm from Excelsior district. Maybe we should have lunch at Las Tinajas or a place of your choice, but with a name like "ladynigarawa", you must not be too proud. Was that so that you could have stopped trying to teach people to pronounce Nicaragua? I've definitely known people here that did that.
You wrote "I came to this country at 10. 14 years later I yearn to be in my home land. This is where I will die". You obviously don't have command of the English language yet, so please don't go back to Nicaragua and try to make $ teaching it. You need some more education. As you can see from your own post, anyone could interpret it as "you love the US so much, that this country is where you will die". Pendeja.
Como dije antes (como me llamaste a mi), talvez sea indio, pero "hijaeputa" seras vos y la tuya culo cagado.
Have a great life after you grow up.
If you're so against people not speaking Spanish
¡Primeramente, hija de puta será tu madre!
¿Segundamente, donde escribí que no estoy orgulloso de haber nacido Nicaragüense? Como yo escribí, no tengo necesidad de vivir en Nicaragua porque la mayoría de mi familia esta aquí. Que bueno que estas allá ayudando a la gente.
The whole point of getting an education here is so one can live wherever he or she pleases and not have to struggle.
If you're so against people not speaking Spanish, what the hell are you doing in this site anyways? Isn’t that one of the main purposes of the site?
100% agreed with you . .
100% agreed with you . . Aunque se vistan de seda monos se quedan :)
I'm not from Nicaragua but I love you country . . . I think I will dying there too . . . I hope more people like you go to live to Nicaland . . :)
Nacistes Pinolero, Indio, te vas a morir pinolero Indio hueputa!!! I like it!!!!!
speak for yourself!!
not the case in many Nicaraguans I know, a few of us are not selfish and think about our country's future and it's people. Besides if you live comfortably rich style in the USA(so you say),why would you go vacationing in Nicaragua? when you could afford other destinations???
FAP
comfortably rich style in...
You probably are the one who has a comfortably rich style in in Nicaragua. Never did I mention in my post that I was living here comfortably rich here in the US. However, I can definitely afford my cost of living. As far as vacationing, ni siquiera escribi eso tampoco. The times I've been back were for family purposes. As far as the country's future goes, all I can do is hope it gets better. There was no reason for me to fly back to Nicaragua to vote, when Nicaragua took what my family owned in the first place. All that I own, is now in this country.
para nada broder
Naci pobre,soy pobre solo que le he hecho huevo.
I am still poor,difference is, I am working with my people making a difference in my country,and I am damn proud of that!!!
FAP
you are the richest man I know of
the wonderful family and friends you have are more valuable than any pile of money ever will be. You get to spend time doing things you love and at the end of the day you have made good jobs for people in your homeland. And the day your little 'future fishing buddy' hooks his first one you may burst with the richness of pride- dude you have it made
-Doug ©
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate
in that aspect
I do consider my self rich :-).
Thanks for your words.
FAP
Hye, FAP
And you should be proud bro!, te rindo el charro!
To go back to work for Nicaland it is not easy decision but I will not make any excuse for it. I remember when I first arrived in ’87 I used to think of going back every day. OK, that’s the past. You see, I could be in a better shape that I am in but I’m sitting here on my fat ass rather than at the gym.
I live in Canada because this is what I've known all my adult life, this is not an excuse, and it is a fact. But the real reason is my lack of cojones.
You're absolutely correct in the fact...
I'm glad that people such yourself can do what you're doing for Nicaragua. You're absolutely correct in the fact that more people need to step up to the plate and help the country. However for me, like I wrote above, my life and my family is here now. My entire immediate family is here. My main job is to provide support and help the support structure of my family here, just like yours is to provide for yours over there.
broder
I have absolutely Nothing againts paisas who have decided to adopt the USA as their new home. I myself became a USA Citizen 15 years ago,most of my Family lives here in the USA. My problem and where I disagree with Paisas who have decided to stay in the USA and never return to their country of birth is when. They trash the situation about the current goverment.
They complain about the economic situation
Just to name a couple.
When you have decided to never return to Nicaragua to live,specially if ALL your family lives in the USA,They should not talk/bash about the above mentioned since they will not and have not been a part of the Country for so many years, and are unwilling to help make a difference/change.
I know of at least 4 Nicas who made their money,working their asses off in the USA for over 25 years, they took a chance and decided to go invest their hard earned money in Nicaragua,guess what? not only did it work out for them,but it also help out our people and country by providing jobs!!
One of them has a tobacco farm in Jalapa and employs over 1,000 people. One became a cattle rancher in Santo Tomas,Chontales and he employs over 100 people. One opened up a Security guard S.A in Managua and he employs over 150 security guards. One opened a Sporting goods store in Sebaco,he employs over 10 people.
As you can see,it takes more than money to make things happen in Nicaragua it takes:
1) Attitude
2) Commitment to what you wanna do.
3) A plan to accomplish what you want to do.
4) Patience .
5) Last but not least,what many people lack even thou having the 4 mentioned above: The Balls To Go For It And Do It!!
If anyone really want to Do something in Nicaragua it should not Really matter who is in goverment(unless they really mess things up,which Ortega has not YET,not fully,but he seems to be headed that way),often times Ortega is just another excuse,why they haven't done anything for their country!!!
FAP
most of the US expats living there left because...
Paisano, your argument is real and true broder. I live where I live and you live where you live. Therefore, you absolutely own this debate, since it's about Nicaragua.
It's just a bit funny though that it's not cool to talk about the situation in Nicaragua without getting into some kind of argument when most of the US expats and Nicas living there left because they were not pleased with the current situation.
They did nothing about it, they just left and talk about us Nicas (come yuca myself, km 14 carretera masaya) who just left Nicaragua and did nothing about it. That's amazing!!!
Your arguments are true and positive man. Like we say son Pijudos y Deacachimbas. I absolutely respect that!
Si decis que sos pobre, eso solamente es en tu mente broder. Con tus pensamientos y lo que estas haciendo, no hay nada de pobreza alli.
Good post
I agree that what is needed is not handouts but to actually invest and create sustainable jobs ("give a man a fish and he will eat for a day, teach him how fish and he will be for a lifetime". I found a website www.nicamade.com It is a christian based business founded by a nica who sells stuff made by locals, which in turns uses the revenue generated to help locals with micro loans and other trade skills. More of the same business mentality is needed if there is going to be any real long term benefits.
THERES THE RUB
The thing my friend is that Nicaragua's cost of living compared to other countries in latin america is overpriced. El dolar no te rinde en Nicaragua.
Only in Nicaragua will you pay $15-20 for a pescado at tipitapa. (the same guapote at el mercado costs $5.00)You pay for the nostalgia, but then even us nicas do not like getting ripped off when anywhere else that meal would not exceed $10.00
Regarding politics, Esteli is proof of the self-destructive behavior of some nicas. Esteli is a picuaco bastion. They made their bed, let them lie in it. Eso les pasa por votar piricuaco.
Look at the sandinistas rabble rousing urging people not to pay back their loans?!?!?!
Microfinancing has been successful everywhere BUT Nicaragua! Why? the sandinista culture of piñatismo and thievery. This is the legacy of Sandinismo in Nicaragua.
Back in the day, if you were a deadbeat debtor you would become a social pariah. In today's Nicaragua, Daniel Ortega encourages you to be a ladron, and not pay your loans!
Asi que broder, mejor sacarse la viga del ojo propio antes de acusar el projimo!
I'm agreed
Nicaragua is the second poorest country in America and the dollar can't buy much there. I have bought a guayabera for $40, paid more than $5 for a gallon of gasoline, spent $90 on a restaurant for a dinner for 4, a car can cost you more than $30.000 and you can see properties selling for more than $100.000 . . . an imported inflation is killing the locals. . . as long gringos and europeans comes over and paid high prices . . . the natives (sellers) keeps the prices up . . . I love Nicaragua but it is getting too expinsive . . . just a thought!
oe paisa
are those prices in cordobas or Lapas verdes? I myself would not pay anything over $120 cordobas for a descent pescado. Now as far as Esteli goes.
1) I have NEVER,nor will I ever will be a Piricuaco thou like you mention Esteli has always been mainly Piricuacos.
2) My vote was NOT for the piricuacos,trust me,I was pretty much forced to leave my country due to the Servicio Militar(Obligado) Patriotico, on which I served 3 months and was lucky to have survive,10 of my Secundaria friends did not.
3) The VAST majority of the Idiots,which were mainly the late 80's early 90's generation that voted for Ortega,mainly because, they were not even born during Ortegas Regime. and the just wanted a change. Now these same Idiots,which I know in Esteli quite a few,thou they are still Sandinistas they are NOT Danielistas ANYMORE!!!
FAP
PIRICUACOS AND THE PRICE OF PESCADOS IN TIPITAPA
gracias for the clarification! your previous comment was very ambiguous....
You are 100% right that the idiots who keep voting for Ortega are the ones ruining Nicaragua, and in the long run themselves.
El trompudo has the country hostage. No serious progress will ever take place in Nicaragua until he disappears from the political arena.
As for the pescado, I agree with you completely. In my travels throughout latin america, I have never paid more than $8 for a pescado at a restaurant.
My comment was an indictment on the shortsightedness of nica business people. They pay their employees in Cordobas while dollarizing their prices without concern for purchasing power. Henry Ford was wise enough to pay his workers enough of a wage that they could afford his own vehicles!
This is why Nicaragua is not competitive re tourism. The Nicaraguans abroad see this, among them several of my friends that say their reales go farther elsewhere!
By the way, when I saw the prices on that pescado I left the joint and told them that they have lost a lifelong customer. Eventually they will go broke as the place was empty.
Tipitapa is a good example of capitalism in action
I know the restaurant you are speaking of. It is owned by Nicaraguans. We ate there once. The food was almost inedible and the prices astronomic. We will never go back since the owners just shrugged their shoulders and walked away.
However, one can not compare the cost of raw materials like the fish at the mercado to the finished product. It is like saying metal and rubber in a car costs $2000.-- therefore a car should cost $4000.--.
Places like the restaurant in Tipitapa will likely not survive because of the free market system. Their customers won't be there for them and they will close. (Eventually.)
Things are far from perfect in Nicaragua. But then again, were they perfect under the previous administrations? I suppose Aleman was such an honest administrator?
A country grows over generations and in all cases there are growing pains. I have faith in Nicaragua and the Nicaraguans that live and work here. They are the ones that will nurture this country, work past the pain and make it what it can be.
I am one of the ones who
I am one of the ones who fled in the 80's. The exodus started in 1979 almost inmediately after the firt uprising against Somoza started and the Cordoba, stable for a generation, started devaluating wildly. Most people did it because, at the time, the future only promised more war, unrest, and uncertainties. Many were also scared of being caught up in the cross fire sure to happen.
The exodus scalated after the FSLN came to power, and yet a few came back when the FSLN lost power in 91, thinking that Nicaragua would return to some semblance of stability, and may even look like a democracy
Sadly, we nicaraguans have never really taken control of our country, allowing foreing interest + the local powerful/corrupt to control it.
You can thank the Reagan
You can thank the Reagan administration for the mass exodus which took place during the 80s. That figure is probably greater than 100,000. Most of the expats settled in Sweetwater, Little Havana, to name a few areas. The reason why many left and didnt stay to help out as you have sugggested, is because the U.S. embargo and U.S.-funded Contra war was causing food shortages which required the government to take over non-productive properties. This also resulted in a devalued the national currency, and was forcing male teenagers as young as 15 to enlist in the army to go fight the Contras. My father and as I'm sure thousands more, did not put up this nonsense and fled the country.
[I think this is pretty accurate as well. If you collect information from all sides you will likely figure out that the truth is a combination of what you see in these two posts.]
was this you or
Ana writting? "My father and as I'm sure thousands more, did not put up this nonsense and fled the country"..
Let me tell you, unless you were really really Stupid,you'd volunteer,besides,if you refuse to enlist/go to the SMP,you would get 3 years jail time,after those 3 years were up,you'd have to enlist again,should you refuse again, another 3 years
FAP
Read the post above
It was me parroting the "opposite" post above it. My point is that either post was "logical" but the truth would be somewhere in between them.
Forcing males to enlist is not the same thing as Mandatory Draft
"This also resulted in a devalued the national currency, and was forcing male teenagers as young as 15 to enlist in the army to go fight the Contras."
Forcing males to enlist is not the same thing as Mandatory Draft or Jail Term, which is what the Sandinistas did. The third alternative to leaving the country was to join the Contras and attempt to fight for what had been lost, which is what many did.
Thank Reagan indeed - we
Thank Reagan indeed - we love the Nicaraguans we got in the deal. The government wasn't required to takeover non-productive properties. Thanks for giving it an agrarian hue. It's not like they took abandoned farms - they stole peoples homes and houses.
Mass exodus
You can thank the FSLN for the mass exodus which took place during the 80s. That figure is probably greater than 100,000. Most of the expats settled in Sweetwater, Little Havana, to name a few areas. The reason why many left and didnt stay to help out as you have sugggested, is because Danielito was taking away properties ( La pinata), devalued the national currency, and was forcing male teenagers as young as 15 to enlist in the army to go fight the Contras. My father and as I'm sure thousands more, did not put up this nonsense and fled the country.
Viva Leon Jodido!