Democracy or An Alternative?

Submitted by fyl on 1 July, 2008 - 06:41.

In a comment here, Michelina says "He is not helping Nicaraguan people in their struggle to built democracy.". She is talking about an article by Toni Solo supporting what many see as Ortega's effort to create a dictatorship here. Her assumption is clearly that Nicaraguan people both want "a democracy" and that they are actively trying to do that. This thread is not about what Ortega is or isn't doing—it is about what Nicaraguans want.

On the most basic level, it seems like a question of what people want the government to provide for them. While many people see "democracy" as an answer, it would seem that when you use that word it just means you have the right to tell the government what you want and the government will then take care of it for you. Or, put another way, the common view of a dictatorship is "the government doesn't listen to you" and in a democracy "the government does listen to you".

I think we can all point to examples where what is supposed to be a democracy didn't address majority interests. While it may be harder to both find and verify that dictators have supported the interests of the majority, it does seem that at least for some time, Somoza Garcia may have been that person.

Besides democracy and dictator being "trigger words", another trigger word is "socialism". The reality is that any government is going to be socialistic. By nature, creating this "service entity" for the people means they will end up collecting money somehow and offering various services. For example, a driver's license is such a service as is a police department. So, the real question is what items do the majority of the Nicaraguans want from the government.

Here are some of the possible services:

  • Internal security and public safety—police, fire
  • Infrastructure—roads, water, electricity, transportation, communications
  • Public services—education, health care
  • Welfare (safety net?)—basic food and shelter; retirement benefits
  • Defense—protection against external invasion
  • People's rights—workplace standards, anti-discrimination

There are lots more but that will do for my example. As each of you look at the list you will see things you think the government should provide and things you think should not be the responsibility of the government. That's fine. But, what matters in Nicaragua is what the majority of the Nicaraguans want.

The obvious next step is how to pay for all these items. That is going to be some form of taxation and, in a democracy, the majority of the people should get to decide how to structure taxes.

Now, we all know that it would be impractical to have everyone vote on each decision to structure the services and the taxes to pay for them. The typical solution is to create a "representative democracy". Instead of each person getting to voice their opinion on what the government should do with each issue, they select people who are paid to represent them. Or, are paid by them and should be representing them.

People have already given up "their democratic rights" by selecting these representatives. They feel that getting a chance to pick these representatives every few years in close enough. But, is it?

As a current (and easily verified) example, the majority of U.S. voters want the Iraq war over. But, the elected representatives are ignoring that request. In a few months those voters will get to re-select their representatives but both presidential candidates and the majority of the Congresscritters don't seem to want to listen to the voters. So, this seems like an example of where a representative democracy doesn't really work. That is, it seems more like you are told you have democracy but you effectively have a dictatorship.

We could analyze this—in Nicaragua, in the U.S. and in lots of other places—but it boils down to "vested interests" rather than the majority of the people getting to direct the government. In Nicaragua, some will say Ortega is just doing what Hugo Chavez asks, some will say he is just trying to satisfy his ego and still others will say it is humoring bankers, the U.S., the IMF, ... rather than doing what the people really want.

Is there an alternative? One method is to have the ability for the people to vote on whether or not they are happy with the current "leader of government". A vote of confidence. If he or she doesn't receive a majority of the votes, it is time for a new one. This was done in Venezuela for example. The result was majority support for Hugo Chavez. In Bolivia, Evo Morales has called for the same thing. He feels a positive result will actually help him move forward with his plans.

Now, if the government could be structured such that there was some guarantee that a leader would step down as the result of a vote of no confidence, does it matter how many people become your representatives? If this could be implemented, wouldn't a "representative dictatorship" be more efficient and yet still give the people the needed control?

Ok, yes, this is all theory. The point I am trying to make is that we need to get beyond the trigger words and actually look at how things need to work to benefit the people. A benevolent dictator, for example, can be a lot more representative than a large representative body that had allegiance to something other than the majority of the population.

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The solution is a

The solution is a representative - and proportional - of as many parties as possible(instantiated as some form of parliamentary government in some European countries).

In the US, government is hampered by having only two party choices and special interest are strenghtened by this arrangement. If one looks at your bullet points, in the US you have to bucket those issues in one party or the next (i.e. health care for the democrats, defense for the republicans) but if you're pro-defense, pro-health care and say pro-choice, anti-illegal immigrant, and pro-environment you're in the middle of nowhere and inevitably have to prioritize your values and choose the lesser of available evils.

When many parties achieve proportional representation based on the number of party votes received on a legitimate election, these representatives must compromise and the chances of one big issue (i.e. abortion) dominating government are diminished.

By the way, Your Hugo Chavez example is a flawed example. Mr. Chavez is a south american Robert Mugave in the making. Individuals that at some point in time had some potential but that are inherently incompetent and once intoxicated by power get completely corrupted by it and only win elections and/or referendums thank to the thugs, and gestapo organizations they surround themselves with.

Democracy of alternative?

Present political status in NIcaragua is alternative of Democracy ,Toni. Nicaraguans are starved for democracy as they demonstrate by marching demonstrations, hunger strikes e.c. t. Your mile or kilometers long articles will not stop destiny. Your KBG propaganda would be good in 1980`s. even Cubas regim is changing so will others follow. Take a chill pill ,this is my advise. Look in Webster dictionary what Democracy stands for.

It's all about perspective

It appears to me that we all are looking for the “Perfect Solution” whatever that may be. And I suppose that is a good thing. Would it not be sad if everyone stopped looking for improvement?

Let’s face it, what is right for one person may well be completely wrong in the eyes of another.

I tend to agree with FYL when he states that every government is socialistic. The fact that every government is required to “look after its people” to some extent, makes it socialistic.

The fact that I spent over 2 decades living in “Socialistic Europe” may have provided me with a better understanding what socialism is all about. The “Capitalistic USA” is becoming more and more socialistic. Many of the US citizens are beginning to look with envy at Canada their socialistic neighbor to the north. This is especially true where healthcare is concerned.

I am not so sure that democracy is the most important item for many Nicaraguans. From my conversations with many Nicaraguans, I get the feeling that where their next meal is coming from is much more important to them. I have been told by several Nicaraguans that they really don’t care about who runs the show as long as they are able to put food on the table and their standard of living does not deteriorate. Sure they want certain freedoms but they would be just as happy with someone that can provide stability in their life.

Every goverment is socialistic?

Perphaps every goverment is facing diffrent social -political issue? Living for 2 decades in socialistic Europe /eastern Europe/ should teach you what "socialism is about" and why they prosper now living in capitalistic system. I dont belive that one party goverment is good for the people. Democracy is also freedom to choose like in Capitalistic countries , freedom to built their destiny., freedom to built buisness and create wealth and jobs. Democracy brings prosperity ,sir. You talking about Canada healthcare being so wanderfull. I know something about it. Canadian people are waiting months and years for necessary medical procedure, and after certain age next stage is to see angels .There is no better health system than in USA. And lastly i noticed there is many people who lives in Nicaragua supported by USA $ and what they do just critisizing and critisizing.President Bush is enemy # 1 but than ....maybe socialism will teach them something I have to quit writting , I might become one of N.L.poster.

trigger words

You have stated your position using the trigger words. Can you present your argument for what is good without using democracy, socialism and capitalism?

This may sound like an exercise but what I am suggesting is that if you actually look at what people want (the majority in the U.S., for example, seem to want more highways bought with tax money but indications are that in Nicaragua they just want to be able to put food on the table) you will get step 1 done. Then you can look at government structures that might be able to supply the needs of the people.

Without democracy , socialism, and capitalism

.... that would be a stone age.

Stop teaching , I studied economics ,and political sience once. If you please go to the base and read priniples of our forthfathers eq. Abraham Lincoln .,I forgot you are Brtish and your expertise is evil U.S.A. goverment. If you are such a supportive of Nicaraguan people try to create jobs for them in this senario, perhaps with socialistic teo Hugo , Evo ,Raul and Ahmanidejad help.

Sorry, I can't help myself

You must have slept through the spelling class!

"if you see someone who has lost their smile, give them one of yours"

Really,

What makes you such a expert, prove it? I am glad that you such a avid reader .

Hey, I was just kidding...

I tried to indicate that with the subject line. Lighten up, I am glad I wasn't sitting next to you, you might have tried to slug me or something.

"if you see someone who has lost their smile, give them one of yours"

Let s have..

a spelling bee match not a blog, i will be first from the bottom.

...colamus humanitatem.

Forget about the spelling michalina

Why not learn the difference between socialism and communism. You seem to be confused about the two! You also seem to be as fanatical a supporter of everything USA as others are opponents of that regime.

You wrote: "Living for 2 decades in socialistic Europe /eastern Europe/ should teach you what "socialism is about" and why they prosper now living in capitalistic system." Did you ever hear of Sweden??? They are on the forefront of socialism. So is Holland and probably 85% of European countries. Socialism does not preclude capitalism. (Communism does!) On the contrary most truly socialist nations are extremely capitalist. How else could they afford all the social services they offer? It takes a strong economy, a social conscience to be a socialist nation.

You are also confusing capitalism with democracy. One has nothing to do with the other. Democracy is simply a form of government and is not a surefire way to make a lot of money unless your company is called Halliburton and you happen to be the VP of a particular country.

As for the healthcare in Canada, I never said it is "wanderful". That is your expression. I simply stated that many folks in the USA feel that it is a pretty darn good system.

Open your eyes and mind to the opinion of others and forget about blindly following the "leader" in goose step.

Is your English flowless ?

Thinking what my father once told me that there is to many teachers and attorneys in this world especially without education. P.S.

Same advise to you... grass is not always greener on other site and dont drink too much of kool aid,it is not good for your health,especially that you dont have Canadian healthcare there . As of Halliburton I would recommend to buy this stock. By the way ,how is Real Estate buisness there ? Lastly , I always follow my principles , not yours nor people I dont know or dont like to know.

What the heck was that all about?

I was strictly addressing your political views.

I did not criticize your English, nor would I. As you well know English is not my first language and it was pointed out here before that my grammar and spelling is far from perfect.

Thanks for asking about business. It is steady and not nearly as slow as one would think listening to the news from "Up North".

As for principles, that is exactly why I did not invest in Halliburton.

I wish you well,

Jon

Not what you wanted to know,?

To explain my political view in your context would take me to much time.That was short version,you understood quickly.

Glad your business is doing well I ve heard diffrent story, must be a gossip. Stay with your principle and stay what you do the best. Belive me I can pay for a teacher if I need one.

Best of all,

Genevieve